Brooks and Capehart on main takeaways from the DNC and what comes next

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• Amna Nawaz:

  The end of the Democratic National Convention marks a major turning point in the battle for the White House.

  On the week's political developments and what comes next, we turn now to the analysis of Brooks and Capehart. That is New York Times columnist David Brooks, and Jonathan Capehart, associate editor for The Washington Post.

  It's great to see you both, I feel like we didn't have time to miss each other.

  (Laughter)

  (Crosstalk)

• Jonathan Capehart:

  I know.

• Amna Nawaz:

  But nice to have you back here on set.

  OK, so for anyone who was not watching every hour of the conventions with us, although I can't imagine why you wouldn't have been, I just want to get your big takeaways here. From the last four days, Jonathan, that the Democrats spent rallying behind their ticket and rolling them out to the nation. What stood out to you from those days?

• Jonathan Capehart:

  The jubilation and relief. There were people who were dreading the convention coming up, and then once the change in the top of the ticket came, you started hearing about people from all over the country trying to figure out how they could get tickets to get inside the hall.

  People wanted to be there. People wanted to be a part of it. And the jubilation is also around a candidate and around a party that is — like, people are hungry. I think they're exhausted by all the negativity and the hate and the heaviness, and they want to be joyful in solving the country's problems, and so over four days, whereas in Milwaukee, every night I felt like when we left the set, I was — like a weighted blanket.

  Four days in Chicago is a completely different experience. And so I think Democrats are — they are happy, they're excited, and I think they have rocketed out of Chicago ready, willing, and able to push Kamala Harris over the finish line.

• Amna Nawaz:

  What about you, David? Do you get that same sense?

• David Brooks:

  Yes, well, certainly the emotional change in the Democratic Party is as stark as it's possible to imagine.

  But if you look at the two parties, the two conventions, I'd say the Republicans doubled down on their core story, and the Democrats expanded their story. And so, by doubling down, I mean, their core story is the elites have betrayed us, we're going to build a working-class army to overthrow the system. And picking J.D. Vance just doubles down on that story.

  And then having Dana White and Hulk Hogan and all, that's just like, yes, this is our story and this is who we're going for.

  But it's like 46 percent of the country. Kamala Harris, on the other hand, I mean, it was not your — like, if you had stereotypes about the Democrats, this convention did not fit them. The vice presidential candidate is shown hunting. There's a bunch of football players lined up on stage. There's a bunch of military people showing up on stage. There's as much patriotism as you can possibly imagine.

  She describes American foreign policy in a pretty hawkish way, and so expanding. And so I don't know if it'll work. And it may be — and the mood of the country may be dark, and that would be good for Trump. But — or as Jonathan says, maybe we're just a little tired of dark and we want a vibe shift.

  And so I thought both — I thought, in general, if you got a core story, you need to expand to win a majority. And so I thought Harris was a little smarter.

• Amna Nawaz:

  And, David, to your point on the policies there, we talked about this during convention coverage too, but this isn't necessarily the place for specific policy proposals. But there was a clearly articulated view of what a Harris presidency would look like in her speech.

• David Brooks:

  Yes, I think she wants to basically subsidize middle-class life, like make rents cheaper, give you a child tax credit, give you extra resources to deal with this stuff you have to deal with, the health care and things like that.

  And so she has a pretty solid set of ways to reduce your costs. I would not say she has a solid set of ideas to expand the economy, to improve productivity. So, the macroeconomics, I don't — just don't think there's anything there so far.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Not that we have seen yet so far, yes.

  Jonathan, there was this issue we talked about briefly as well, the division within the party about U.S. policy towards Israel and its war in Gaza. We saw protesters outside. We saw the DNC decide to deny a Palestinian-American a speaking slot on stage.

  And what I heard from many of those folks who wanted to see that speaker was, you can't call yourself the party of inclusion and dialogue, and then deny someone like this a speaking spot. What do you think about that? Was that a mistake?

• Jonathan Capehart:

  Well, I don't know. And I will admit that I don't know who the speaker who was denied the speaking slot, what they were going to say.

  Look, I'm trying to remember what I said the other — exactly what I said the other night. But I see why the person, why a speaking slot was not given to a pro-Palestinian person, also because the vice president handled the issue very forcefully in her speech.

• Amna Nawaz:

  In her remarks.

• Jonathan Capehart:

  In her remarks. And I think, quite honestly, that's where it belonged. People wanted to know where she stood. What does she think? Where is she going to take this?

  Especially since folks are really angry with President Biden and how he's conducting things. If she's the next president, people want to know, where is she going? And she clearly articulated what she felt. And I thought she handled it masterfully, very pro-Israel, right to exist. We are going to — we are going to help defend Israel, but also very pro-Palestinian, the suffering, the hunger.

  You need to…

• Amna Nawaz:

  The right to self-determination.

• Jonathan Capehart:

  That's the word — that's what I'm looking for.

  (Crosstalk)

• Amna Nawaz:

  Big applause line as well in the hall, right? Yes.

• Jonathan Capehart:

  Right.

  And so what we saw in the hall, what I saw in the hall was support for both sides and a hunger for resolution. Cease-fire got a huge round of applause.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Well, we already have our first post-convention curveball in the race just today. Robert F. Kennedy Jr., who has been running as an independent, of course, said that he's suspending his campaign.

  He's endorsing Donald Trump. He's trying to remove his name from some states on which he's on the ballot, but staying on others. We should also say that five of his siblings issued a statement calling his endorsement of Donald Trump a betrayal of their father and their family's values.

  Jonathan, what could be the impact on the race?

• Jonathan Capehart:

  You know, quite honestly, I don't know. And just the mention of his name produces such a wave of ennui for me that I just — I can't work up any kind of excitement or anger. It is sad for the Kennedy family that he is doing this, that he was running for president to begin with all of the horrible stories associated with him, and then to come out and endorse Donald Trump as a result.

  What impact it's going to have on the race, I don't know. Probably negligible, but — and if he stays on the ballot, maybe folks who could have voted for Kamala Harris might vote for him. But it is literally a wasted vote.

• Amna Nawaz:

  David, what do you make of it? Do his supporters go to Trump because he's endorsed him?

• David Brooks:

  Most of them. First, I'm struck that your ennui comes in waves.

  (Laughter)

• David Brooks:

  Mine comes in drizzles.

  (Laughter)

• David Brooks:

  But I think most of them probably will, and because, in retrospect, they're sort of telling the same story, that there's all these crazy conspiracies by elites and our systems need to be taken apart.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Yes.

• David Brooks:

  And that's the RFK story, and that's the Donald Trump story. And so I think people who want to — who were voting for RFK sort of buy into that story.

  And so Trump seems to make some sense. So I imagine — it won't make some big effect on the race. But in a tight race…

• Amna Nawaz:

  You don't think it will, even in a tight race, as we have been talking about, if that's what we expect to see? A small number of voters, could they make a difference?

• David Brooks:

  It absolutely could make a difference.

  I also think Cornel West is still out there, could make a difference. And, again, when the margins are so small, third-party candidates could make a difference.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Well, look, if we take a step back now, post-conventions now for both parties, we have very different visions and messages from both campaigns.

  They're absolutely crystal clear, and they're probably best summarized by a couple of moments that we pulled out from each candidate's acceptance speech. Take a listen.

  Donald Trump, Former President of the United States (R) and Current U.S. Presidential Candidate: For too long, our nation has settled for too little. We settled for too little. We have given everything to other nations, to other people. You have been told to lower your expectations and to accept less for your families.

  I am here tonight with the opposite message. Your expectations are not big enough.

  Kamala Harris, Vice President of the United States (D) and U.S. Presidential Candidate: Our nation with this election has a precious, fleeting opportunity to move past the bitterness, cynicism and divisive battles of the past, a chance to chart a new way forward.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Jonathan, the challenge now for each campaign is to link those messages and those visions with the things that matter most to Americans, right, everyday cost of living, safety in our communities, the ability to feel like their lives are or could be better.

  How do they do that?

• Jonathan Capehart:

  Well, I think the vice president did it by — and everyone did it by talking about kitchen table issues, cost issues. And she has the opportunity economy that she talked about.

  Donald Trump, I can't tell you what his policies are, other than drill, baby drill, and tax cut. For whom, I don't know, maybe an extension of the Trump tax cuts, which helped — benefited the folks at the top — upper end of the income scale.

  But that's probably the nicest thing from Trump's speech that you pulled out. Your expectations are not big enough. In isolation, that could be a positive-sounding thing, except it was wrapped around two hours of just darkness and meanness.

  And I think the problem that Donald Trump is going to have and the Republicans are having is that he can't talk about policy, no matter how many times people ask him to do it. He's about personal insults and degradation. And as we have seen in the last four days in Chicago, the Democrats are speaking not as much policy as David would want, but certainly a whole lot more policy than is coming out of the GOP.

• David Brooks:

  Yes, in those two clips, you see Donald Trump's message, which is, America's been in decline, and we need to turn it around. And so it's a decline story.

  And then Kamala Harris' message, it's implicit in her being. It's a historic moment. A Black woman gets nominated for a major political party in the United States of America. It's a moment of, we have got hope for the future now. And so she's telling a much more optimistic story.

  And so it shows up even in policies, and so a very assertive role for America and the world, defend Ukraine, defend liberal democracy. That's Kamala Harris. By contrast, Donald Trump, we don't need that war. Our NATO allies are screwing us, they're taking all our money, they're not contributing, we're getting sucked in, we can't afford it, and so let's withdraw.

  And so you see how these postures of optimism versus pessimism, I guess I will call it, create a set of policies that are either very outward-focused and ambitious or let's pull inward and protect ourselves.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Thirty seconds left, what do you expect to see over the next week? Anything that could surprise us, you think?

• David Brooks:

  Oh, Socratic levels of arguments.

  (Laughter)

• Amna Nawaz:

  I mean, I don't know where to go from there.

  David Brooks, Jonathan Capehart, always great to see you.

• Jonathan Capehart:

  Great to see you.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Welcome back to town. Get some rest.

• Jonathan Capehart:

  Oh, you better believe it.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Thank you both.

• Jonathan Capehart:

  Thank you.